So what Glastron hull model did everybody copy? [Archive] (2023)

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CaryW

07-28-2011, 03:16 PM

Looking at the cobra thread and other Sidewinder threads, it is always mentioned that they are a pop of a Glastron hull. Looking back at old pictures and brochures, most of the late 60's/very early 70 Glastrons were a deep V until the Gt line came out which is a shallow V or even a modified v like the GT150.

I could see someone copying a 150 or 160 hull but the Sidewinders seem to predate them or at least appeared at exactly the same time.

What was the Glastron Performance V in a 16 to 18 ft boat back then? Was it a good hull design just hidden by a family style boat with a giant windshield?

Mark75H

07-28-2011, 06:25 PM

No, the Glastron was always a modified V, not a deep

T2x

07-29-2011, 07:29 AM

No, the Glastron was always a modified V, not a deep

Sorry but that is incorrect...... here is the hull that was copied by a large number of boat builders. Glastron fielded a major racing effort starting in 1963 and included Offshore racing with their 20 and 24 foot models. The hulls were a full deep vee of at least 20 degrees deadrise. This picture is of my 1965 Bayflite 163 which had as I recall 20 degrees of vee and full longitudinal strakes ala Bertram and Alim. The first Checkmate vees came out in 1966 and The Sidewinder a year or two after that. Some builders "popped" at the chine and styled the sides and deck, others like sidewinder went further up the hull and included the inset transom sculpting that Glastron pioneered and which can clearly be seen in this picture.

T2x

239166

T2x

07-29-2011, 07:44 AM

Here is a picture of a Mid 60's Glastron 14 foot Jetflite, which was the absolute hit of the NY Boat Show in 1964. Glastron displayed a blue Metalflake and white version on an elevated stand rotating well above eye level. It was the very first sleekly designed deep vee boat and the first time I had seen metalflake gel coat used direct from a factory....... You can clearly see the full deep vee hull. This was also when talented drivers learned to "saw the wheel" to maintain stability at speed instead of chine walking. My race hull had two RH lower units since there was no shiftable LH option available from the factory and you needed FNR in both engines in JJ class.

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gofish7070

07-29-2011, 12:08 PM

If memory is correct, Didn"t Jon Culver and Cliff Reif run a blue & white Glastron????????

Mark75H

07-29-2011, 06:38 PM

Rich, where do deep V and shallow V part ways?

velox

07-30-2011, 09:16 AM

If memory is correct, Didn"t Jon Culver and Cliff Reif run a blue & white Glastron????????

I know Jon Culver ran a twin engine Glastron. Geroge Griley, Richard Baiz and I ran George's Blue and White 16 footer in the 1964 6 hour Grand National martthon and won the Twin Engine Ublimited. Jon ran his in the same race and won the JJ class. One week later both boats ran and finished the 9 hour Orange bowl regatta held at the Miami Marine Stadium. Glastron ran a picture of both boats together during the 6 hour for several years as their advertisement.

T2x

08-01-2011, 07:02 AM

Rich, where do deep V and shallow V part ways?

To me a Shallow (semi) vee is about 15 degrees or less. The marathon Inboard hulls and the early semi V hulls fall into this class. I don't know what Glastron's later hull designs were based on but all of the mid 60's stuff was a full "deep V" and that would include anything from 19 to 26 degrees. The Challenger/Shadows were 21 degrees and the 24' Cigarette/Magnum/Superboat/Pantera are about 24 degrees. This is the basic range of most deep V Offshore designs. By the way the 1964 Glastron 17 footer had at least 21 degrees of Vee.

T2x

08-01-2011, 07:10 AM

If memory is correct, Didn"t Jon Culver and Cliff Reif run a blue & white Glastron????????

Jon Culver and Cliff Reif ran a Brown and White 17' Glastron called "The Stamper" ( I am a little color blind but it wasn't blue/white) to JJ class and overall victory in the Hudson River Marathon in 1964. In 1965, they switched to a metalflake blue and white 16' Glastron that was otherwise identical to mine.

Jon was probably the best OPC setup guy in the country at that time and he provided "worked" bronze Mercury props to a lot of racers including me. I could never get them to plane the boat with a load however and used mostly 410 MIchigans in races. Jon also owned the Midwest distributership for Kiekhaefer Mercury and could use his parts bins to collect "factory balanced" rods and pistons of identical weight without using any grinding (illegal in those days). Smart guy, a great racer, and a good friend.

T2x

velox

08-01-2011, 11:33 AM

Jon was probably the best OPC setup guy in the country at that time and he provided "worked" bronze Mercury props to a lot of racers including me. I could never get them to plane the boat with a load however and used mostly 410 Michigan's in races. Jon also owned the Midwest distributership for Kiekhaefer Mercury and could use his parts bins to collect "factory balanced" rods and pistons of identical weight without using any grinding (illegal in those days). Smart guy, a great racer, and a good friend.

T2x

I remember Jon's setup in the Glastron. He had a movable fuel tank to allow for balance during different phases of the race depending on conditions.
In the referenced 6 hour where we won the unlimited and Jon won the JJ Class we also ran the Michigan "cupped" props. We were running a high RPM and Mr K complained that we were going to blow an engine and make Mercury look bad. We ran the complete 6 hour followed by the 9 hour one week later and only pulled the cowls to check everything. We did find one distributor cap a little loose. 16 hours flat out with no problems is a great display of machinery. For the next couple of years Glastron ran a large photo of Jon's and George's boats side by side for their advertising.
The 16' Glastron looked like a tub, the the performance was incredible in the day!
BTW, Jimmie Seawars pulled me water skiing at top speed behind that boat.
I clocked 65 MPH on water skis and a couple of years ago, I clocked 65 MPH on snow skis!
PS When we ran the 9 hour, both our boat and Jon's were well ahead of the fiberglass Switzers for the first 7 to 8 hours. When the water got calm the Switzers could go a litte faster and pulled ahead. The big difference was the Switzers had the very first Super Speedmasters ever raced and both Glastrons had stock lower units. If the Glastrons had the Speedmasters we would have gone 1, 2 in the race. Two weeks after the 9 hour, Mr K let George have the very first SS released to non factory racers.

T2x

08-01-2011, 03:44 PM

I remember Jon's setup in the Glastron. He had a movable fuel tank to allow for balance during different phases of the race depending on conditions.
In the referenced 6 hour where we won the unlimited and Jon won the JJ Class we also ran the Michigan "cupped" props. We were running a high RPM and Mr K complained that we were going to blow an engine and make Mercury look bad. We ran the complete 6 hour followed by the 9 hour one week later and only pulled the cowls to check everything. We did find one distributor cap a little loose. 16 hours flat out with no problems is a great display of machinery. For the next couple of years Glastron ran a large photo of Jon's and George's boats side by side for their advertising.
The 16' Glastron looked like a tub, the the performance was incredible in the day!
BTW, Jimmie Seawars pulled me water skiing at top speed behind that boat.
I clocked 65 MPH on water skis and a couple of years ago, I clocked 65 MPH on snow skis!
PS When we ran the 9 hour, both our boat and Jon's were well ahead of the fiberglass Switzers for the first 7 to 8 hours. When the water got calm the Switzers could go a litte faster and pulled ahead. The big difference was the Switzers had the very first Super Speedmasters ever raced and both Glastrons had stock lower units. If the Glastrons had the Speedmasters we would have gone 1, 2 in the race. Two weeks after the 9 hour, Mr K let George have the very first SS released to non factory racers.

It was the first Glastron deep vee 17 and 19 footers that looked like "tubs". The later deep Vee 16 footers were very sleak

seeroy

08-01-2011, 08:00 PM

Well, Well. Here's a sleek 15' Glastron vee bottom, cut down, decked over and rigged by Jim Harkins and the kid driving. Darn, I just can't remember his name. Anyway, he was 1st place Class A inboard and 10th overall in this 1964 Gold Coast Marathon. His big brother was 2nd overall behind Dave Craig. I can't remember his brother's name either, but it seems vaguely familiar.:rolleyes: EEK! 47 years ago :eek:. Note the dry short open exhaust stack behind the rear carb. This same kid ran this boat in Miami 9 hour. Led Class A by large margin until he busted a hole in it and sunk it in the pits. After that Fast Freddy Darwick and his wife took over and won Class A inboard with their Volvo Penta. Mr Kiekhaefer was not real pleased about that. Neither was Bob Hammond. But Fred Darwick and I have a good laugh about it every year at OFF :D. - Seeroy

http://i51.tinypic.com/o6k6xu.jpg

gofish7070

08-02-2011, 02:15 PM

I remember that boat,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, A 110 H.P. Mercrusier my a**,,,,,,,,,,

T2x

08-02-2011, 05:40 PM

I remember that boat,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, A 110 H.P. Mercrusier my a**,,,,,,,,,,

I wrote an article in speedonthewater.com a few weeks ago about Willie Schaefer a good friend of mine who raced a 15 Glastron (see photo below)with dual 1100's back in '66. The thing about that hull was it was identical to the later 16 footer with a more abrupt angle at the bow making it 12 inches shorter overall. In fact it spanned identically and was a bit quicker in turns, acceleration, and top speed.

239549

T2x

08-02-2011, 05:50 PM

These are the hulls that begat Checkmate, Baja, Sidewinder, Wreidt, Critchfield, and a number of others.

P.S. I think they're beautiful even by today's standards.

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MagicFloat

08-02-2011, 07:43 PM

The thread title made me chuckle.Better question would be "Which Glastron hulls were never copied?" Answer,"Almost None." Most every model Glastron built was copied by somebody,including the most copied boat in history,the V-156 tri-hull open bow runaboat,to their original deckboat,to their bassboats,even a couple of small 14' sailboats. If imitation is the sincerest form of flattery,Bob Hamond is the most flattered boat builder ever.And he never sued anyone,as the world's largest boat builder back in his day,guess he didn't care.We were a Glastron dealer for over 30 years.Thanks for the memories,Bob.

Mark75H

08-02-2011, 07:44 PM

I love the Jetfire. Bob never sued anyone, because the copies were almost always inferior in some way ... his product spoke for itself

T2x

08-02-2011, 09:25 PM

I love the Jetfire. Bob never sued anyone, because the copies were almost always inferior in some way ... his product spoke for itself

Sam: The Jetflite may be the neatest sport boat ever designed.......

kevindw

08-02-2011, 11:27 PM

I'm new to this forum and this brings back some memories. I grew up on Long Island and remember/experienced many of these classics!

T2X, I'm floored by your knowledge, experience and history with outboard performance boats!

It's a a pleasure to read your posts.

-Kevin

T2x

08-03-2011, 12:08 AM

I'm new to this forum and this brings back some memories. I grew up on Long Island and remember/experienced many of these classics!

T2X, I'm floored by your knowledge, experience and history with outboard performance boats!

It's a a pleasure to read your posts.

-Kevin

Thanks Kevin:

i grew up on Long Island and Queens as well......

kevindw

08-03-2011, 12:23 AM

I still have family in Northport and come back to visit often.

I'm out in CA now and have a vacation home on a mountain lake. I'm looking for a Challenger/Shadow to bring west. I hope I can set up one of your original designs.

-Kevin

T2x

08-03-2011, 11:54 AM

I still have family in Northport and come back to visit often.

I'm out in CA now and have a vacation home on a mountain lake. I'm looking for a Challenger/Shadow to bring west. I hope I can set up one of your original designs.

-Kevin

Give the "original design" credit for the 21' hulls to George Linder (with a tip of the hat to Bob D'argagnon and Jon Ives of Eltro).

CVX20SPRINT

08-03-2011, 07:20 PM

I think personally that the Carlsons were were some of the best looking boats ever built.I love the looks of my CVX20 Sprint.Not one of the fastest hulls,but one of the best looking Glastrons.

baddjonny

08-03-2011, 07:36 PM

I bought one of the 1100's from willie S that was on that glastron as I was a local freeport kid that was into fast boats I used to hang out at K&K .Back in the old days when big kenny was still around in the little shop up front

jon b

T2x

08-03-2011, 08:37 PM

I bought one of the 1100's from willie S that was on that glastron as I was a local freeport kid that was into fast boats I used to hang out at K&K .Back in the old days when big kenny was still around in the little shop up front

jon b

I worked at K&K in '65 and '66....still visit there often. Probably one of the most under rated performance shops in history...

Tx Guy

10-27-2014, 11:24 AM

Thanks for the photos guys!

peterse90

11-01-2014, 05:53 PM

Here in Canada there were several companies that copied Glastrons (and later even Glastron/Carlsons). One company that actually did OK for a few years in the late 60's was North Craft who actually made a few 16's for Sportscraft racing here. These pictures are of Spencer Dunn who later became a factory tunnel boat driver for both Mercury and OMC here in Canada and competed in the Outboard World Championships a few times. North Craft also made a very popular 14 footer called a North Craft Playboy - probably a copy of a Jetflite.
Other Canadian builders that copied Glastrons were Peterborough, Princecraft and Vanguard.
I got to drive a Glastron 16 with Johnson GT115, maybe went about 55mph but was a great wave jumper and sounded great back in the day...not sure how fast UU 36 would go but I bet Spencer had a big grin on his face;
308989308990

olboatman

11-01-2014, 07:08 PM

Scribed. Very interesting and informative reading! Thanks Guys. Gary

shadowcat

11-01-2014, 07:48 PM

- I had a Northcraft playboy for years growing up and it was an awesome boat- with an 85 hp merc it was fast and handled the waves by flying through the air - Spencer Dunn raced a Northcraft I believe

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